.hack//SIGN, though most people don't appreciate it, is a very deep story and very well done IMO. So I was wondering... What kind of symbolism did you recognize throughout .hack//SIGN? For example, the tower (speculated to be a cell phone) at the beginning of the series, or Aura's "room." I'm kind of interested to hear what other people got out of that series.
The one thing that stood out to me was the Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground. It just seemed like a metaphor for Tsukasa's personality. Reticent, secret, alone, dark & dreary, bleak, and somewhat depressing. However, it's also shown as a place of sanctuary and respite also, which I found kind of interesting.
Symbolism?
Moderator: Moderators
Re: Symbolism?
that is the place i would go to in fragment...i haven't watched much but i noticed the markings on the faces in the opeing music it all had tsukasa's marking...then some other marking that is much brighter...S1lentOp wrote: The one thing that stood out to me was the Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground. It just seemed like a metaphor for Tsukasa's personality. Reticent, secret, alone, dark & dreary, bleak, and somewhat depressing. However, it's also shown as a place of sanctuary and respite also, which I found kind of interesting.
-
SnowManZero
- Evil Incarnate
- Posts: 1356
- Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2006 12:48 am
- Location: New South Whales in Australia.i'm not the only one? that's so cool.*act's like sora*
all the name's of level's in dot hack serie's and game's are desciptive of the thing which you find there.
EG sora was found in lambda stalking betrayed nothingness. he was a PK of garmina gadelica(lambda server) he was known for stalking people before killing them, he betrayed the dothacker's and then morganna and nothingness could be a description of what his soul was like, or him in a coma.
what i like is aura's room, and how it reflected the desctructive and constructive nature of tsukassa(so to speak).
when he was happy, it was bright and peacefull and when he gave up on everything it was very dark and even the bed fell apart.
does anyone know why macha didn't /couldn't be heard?
EG sora was found in lambda stalking betrayed nothingness. he was a PK of garmina gadelica(lambda server) he was known for stalking people before killing them, he betrayed the dothacker's and then morganna and nothingness could be a description of what his soul was like, or him in a coma.
what i like is aura's room, and how it reflected the desctructive and constructive nature of tsukassa(so to speak).
when he was happy, it was bright and peacefull and when he gave up on everything it was very dark and even the bed fell apart.
does anyone know why macha didn't /couldn't be heard?
-
AuraTwilight
- IT WAS OVER 9000!
- Posts: 8032
- Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:03 pm
Morganna is exactly like Tsukasa's father, and it's ironic that the only way he could log out was by realizing both worlds were exactly the same.
Also, .hack//SIGN had an Alice in Wonderland feel. Tsukasa was Alice, the World being Wonderland. Morganna was the Queen of Hearts, Maha was the Chesire Cat, and Aura was the Rabbit.
Along with that, there's also a Wizard of Oz theme. The Real World is portrayed as silent and black and white, boring and dull and hostile with the color red being the only shade. Red being dangerous and bloody. The World was colorful, fun, and great. That is until Morganna, the Wicked Witch, started causing trouble. Aura/The Key of the Twilight was the Wizard of Oz, since everyone wanted something from her, but like in the story, the only way Aura could give them anything was by defeating the Witch. Ultimately, it is not Aura who fulfills their dreams, but their own endeavors as human beings. Tsukasa, for example, is only able to log out by realizing, quite literally, that there is no place like home.
Also, .hack//SIGN had an Alice in Wonderland feel. Tsukasa was Alice, the World being Wonderland. Morganna was the Queen of Hearts, Maha was the Chesire Cat, and Aura was the Rabbit.
Along with that, there's also a Wizard of Oz theme. The Real World is portrayed as silent and black and white, boring and dull and hostile with the color red being the only shade. Red being dangerous and bloody. The World was colorful, fun, and great. That is until Morganna, the Wicked Witch, started causing trouble. Aura/The Key of the Twilight was the Wizard of Oz, since everyone wanted something from her, but like in the story, the only way Aura could give them anything was by defeating the Witch. Ultimately, it is not Aura who fulfills their dreams, but their own endeavors as human beings. Tsukasa, for example, is only able to log out by realizing, quite literally, that there is no place like home.
All will obey the mighty Auratwilight
AT, you are officially the greatest person in the world.
DO NOT F*CK WITH AURATWILIGHT!
Please do not PM me. Use my email.NEVER EVER lecture AT. He/she is the Dr. House of these boards.
... hah.. symbolism in .hack//SIGN... I could go on for hours about this...
The original color theory of mine is a lot deeper than just saying it's like the Wizard of Oz. When it shows color in the real world, only technology is shown with great illumination and glow showing that it's "alive" while everything else looks very depressed and kind of "washed out" (not entirely grayscale, but kind of this dark blue-gray monotone). Also, another thing to note is about how dialogue in the real world is presented. Or rather, the irony of. In online games, the default way to communicate is via text, but this is how people are shown communicating in the real world; with lines of text. No one in the real world really speaks - even Tsukasa and Subaru at the end speak with the text (okaeri nasai, tadaima) in the end. Tsukasa does however talk to herself, to show that her mind is now in the real world rather than the game world. But when they speak to each other, the backgrounds are now colored. And during the ending, even after the real world becomes color, the screen has this "static fuzz" shaking around it. The best way to interpret this along with the way the backgrounds of the text screens are now colored, imo, is that the ending is a symbol of the connection of the real world and the online world - rather than totally segregating them. Tsukasa has not totally separated herself from the real world, nor has she from the online world - she accepts both.
Aside from the ending, I found Subaru's "destruction" in episode 19 to be very rich in symbolism.
She remembers what Crim told her in the past, and gives the same attitude to Kaho as she did in the flashback to the three PK'ers. However, what's symbolic about this is what she says. Subaru tells the PK'ers, "Behave yourselfs. Refrain from acting like this." and she tells Kaho somethimg more personal. Two episodes before this, BT told her she could not just declare herself "just Subaru" so suddenly - she had to actually become "just Subaru" and this scene ultimately shows her becoming and realizing what "just Subaru" means. Crim, in the flashback, tells her "I have made you carry something very heavy" and then they show her in the desert field, and her hand is empty, but she struggles to lift it. This scene is the ultimate showing of Subaru's transition from "Subaru of the Crimson Knights" to "just Subaru". When she is laying face down on the ground, she is Subaru of the Crimson Knights. When she raises to her crawling position on the ground, she has become "just Subaru". What's also very symbolic about these scenes is how Subaru is walking. She struggles to stand in the desert, and limps through the cave to Tsukasa. She reflects her real life struggle in her wheelchair. She then finds Tsukasa in the cave. Subaru asks Tsukasa if Tsukasa was waiting, Tsukasa says maybe, and Subaru says that she was waiting for herself. What is referred to by "waiting" is waiting for Subaru to change. Then Tsukasa, taken back, accepts Subaru as "just Subaru". Tsukasa asks Subaru if change hurts, as if to offer to relieve her pain, but she says no and requests silence. She wishes to have keep pain to herself and she doesn't want to burden Tsukasa; as a Crimson Knight, all of the knights were imposed upon with her pain because she was their leader, but now she wishes to assume it only for herself. Subaru apologizes to Tsukasa for "taking so long", and then she Subaru thanks Tsukasa. The way you can tell that Tsukasa has accepted her as "just Subaru" is when Tsukasa tells Subaru she can cry as much as she wants. As a leader, Subaru can't just break down and cry - she is expected to be stronger than that, but then with Tsukasa, who has accepted her as she is and as she appears (a very broken down person on the inside and her characters outside), tells her she can cry.
The original color theory of mine is a lot deeper than just saying it's like the Wizard of Oz. When it shows color in the real world, only technology is shown with great illumination and glow showing that it's "alive" while everything else looks very depressed and kind of "washed out" (not entirely grayscale, but kind of this dark blue-gray monotone). Also, another thing to note is about how dialogue in the real world is presented. Or rather, the irony of. In online games, the default way to communicate is via text, but this is how people are shown communicating in the real world; with lines of text. No one in the real world really speaks - even Tsukasa and Subaru at the end speak with the text (okaeri nasai, tadaima) in the end. Tsukasa does however talk to herself, to show that her mind is now in the real world rather than the game world. But when they speak to each other, the backgrounds are now colored. And during the ending, even after the real world becomes color, the screen has this "static fuzz" shaking around it. The best way to interpret this along with the way the backgrounds of the text screens are now colored, imo, is that the ending is a symbol of the connection of the real world and the online world - rather than totally segregating them. Tsukasa has not totally separated herself from the real world, nor has she from the online world - she accepts both.
Aside from the ending, I found Subaru's "destruction" in episode 19 to be very rich in symbolism.
She remembers what Crim told her in the past, and gives the same attitude to Kaho as she did in the flashback to the three PK'ers. However, what's symbolic about this is what she says. Subaru tells the PK'ers, "Behave yourselfs. Refrain from acting like this." and she tells Kaho somethimg more personal. Two episodes before this, BT told her she could not just declare herself "just Subaru" so suddenly - she had to actually become "just Subaru" and this scene ultimately shows her becoming and realizing what "just Subaru" means. Crim, in the flashback, tells her "I have made you carry something very heavy" and then they show her in the desert field, and her hand is empty, but she struggles to lift it. This scene is the ultimate showing of Subaru's transition from "Subaru of the Crimson Knights" to "just Subaru". When she is laying face down on the ground, she is Subaru of the Crimson Knights. When she raises to her crawling position on the ground, she has become "just Subaru". What's also very symbolic about these scenes is how Subaru is walking. She struggles to stand in the desert, and limps through the cave to Tsukasa. She reflects her real life struggle in her wheelchair. She then finds Tsukasa in the cave. Subaru asks Tsukasa if Tsukasa was waiting, Tsukasa says maybe, and Subaru says that she was waiting for herself. What is referred to by "waiting" is waiting for Subaru to change. Then Tsukasa, taken back, accepts Subaru as "just Subaru". Tsukasa asks Subaru if change hurts, as if to offer to relieve her pain, but she says no and requests silence. She wishes to have keep pain to herself and she doesn't want to burden Tsukasa; as a Crimson Knight, all of the knights were imposed upon with her pain because she was their leader, but now she wishes to assume it only for herself. Subaru apologizes to Tsukasa for "taking so long", and then she Subaru thanks Tsukasa. The way you can tell that Tsukasa has accepted her as "just Subaru" is when Tsukasa tells Subaru she can cry as much as she wants. As a leader, Subaru can't just break down and cry - she is expected to be stronger than that, but then with Tsukasa, who has accepted her as she is and as she appears (a very broken down person on the inside and her characters outside), tells her she can cry.
I found it to be like Tsukasa as well. Especially when you consider how Tsukasa was the main character, that field was a key element in many situations in //SIGN.The one thing that stood out to me was the Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground. It just seemed like a metaphor for Tsukasa's personality. Reticent, secret, alone, dark & dreary, bleak, and somewhat depressing. However, it's also shown as a place of sanctuary and respite also, which I found kind of interesting.
The opening episode hit me right away with its imagery of (re)birth: Tsukasa wakes up inside the belly of a fleshy meatwall dungeon, disoriented and covered in slime, the heavy sound of his breathing rising over the scene, while the choral chants of "The World" sing homage to new life. He is born anew.
Tsukasa's little bubbles of sound - his constant moaning, panting and breathing, while annoying after a while - probably reflect the fact that he is a living creature within this digital realm.
The everpresent bugs - the smily-faced ladybugs, the green fireflies - I assumed they were representative of the computer "bugs" that are creeping in on The World, although their use within the show lacks consistency.
Tsukasa smashing a bug with his staff (ep 1) symbolized, to me, his role within the system as a cleansing agent.
And in a way, he is the catalyst for the disinfections to come.
The trademark "A in C minor chord" signified, to me, moments of liminality, where the boundaries of the system and the real world break down. The big example is Subaru's tear - falling when she finds a truly meaningful love in an artificial realm.
It also plays onthe approach to Harald, a psudo-Tsukasa also trapped in The World and who defies boundaries.
Tsukasa's little bubbles of sound - his constant moaning, panting and breathing, while annoying after a while - probably reflect the fact that he is a living creature within this digital realm.
The everpresent bugs - the smily-faced ladybugs, the green fireflies - I assumed they were representative of the computer "bugs" that are creeping in on The World, although their use within the show lacks consistency.
Tsukasa smashing a bug with his staff (ep 1) symbolized, to me, his role within the system as a cleansing agent.
And in a way, he is the catalyst for the disinfections to come.
The trademark "A in C minor chord" signified, to me, moments of liminality, where the boundaries of the system and the real world break down. The big example is Subaru's tear - falling when she finds a truly meaningful love in an artificial realm.
It also plays onthe approach to Harald, a psudo-Tsukasa also trapped in The World and who defies boundaries.
-
marthwmaster
- The Fullglass Optimist
- Posts: 1405
- Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:29 pm
- Location: to the east of west
Is anyone familiar with Joseph Campbell's monomyth theory (also known as the Hero's Journey)? If you've not heard of it, check out Wikipedia's entry on "monomyth" at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monomyth. Despite the warnings posted at the top, as far as I can tell it seems accurate for the most part. I spent some time coming up with a monomythic analysis of .hack//SIGN and the .hack videogames. Here's what I came up with for SIGN for each phase of the journey (note that not all of these steps occur in chronological order to the story). Please refer to the Wikipedia entry as you read this unless you're intimately familiar with the monomyth theory, as it'll make the most sense that way. 
DEPARTURE
The Call to Adventure: Tsukasa finds himself unable to logout.
Refusal of the Call: He rejects human contact due to his experiences outside "The World."
Supernatural Aid: He meets Mimiru, Bear, and later Subaru, as well as many others in the game.
Crossing of the First Threshold: He defeats the Silver Knight and avoids capture for a while, though he is unable to do so without the aid of the Guardian given to him by Morganna.
Belly of the Whale: He is captured and brought before Subaru, Lady of the Knights, an encounter that will shape the future of his experiences within "The World." Also, the first time we see Tsukasa, he is inside a dungeon that looks like the belly of some giant creature.
INITIATION
Road of Trials: Tsukasa's struggle is an inward one: through the help of his friends, and especially Subaru, he needs to realize his potential.
Meeting with the Goddess: At first, I thought Morganna could be the Goddess, but really, she's a malevolent figure in the story, and the Goddess is portrayed as good-natured and loving towards the hero. In my opinion, Tsukasa meets with the Goddess when he realizes that "he" is a girl IRL, and thus comes to terms with his female aspect. Subaru is also a Goddess-like figure to Tsukasa.
Woman as Temptress: Tsukasa is tormented by Macha, and persuaded by Morganna to remain in "The World," where it is safe for him. In the game series, Macha is revealed to be "the Temptress."
Atonement with the Father: He loses the fear of his father and of Morganna, and at that point, Aura awakens from her sleep.
Apotheosis: He finally becomes able to logout.
The Ultimate Boon: He can now meet his friends in the real world. Aura is free, provided she can evade constant pursuit by Skeith long enough to give the Book of Twilight to one who is worthy.
RETURN
Refusal of the Return: Tsukasa is unsure of whether he wants to return after discovering his identity in the world, and the implications regarding his involvement with Subaru. Subaru chases these fears away, saying that she was "touched by his soul."
The Magic Flight: I couldn't come up with anything for this (at least in .hack//SIGN); does anyone have any ideas?
Rescue from Without: Helba shuts down the Net Slum in order to rescue Tsukasa and his friends from Skeith.
Crossing of the Return Threshold: Tsukasa, Subaru and Mimiru must test their resolve as well as their belief in their friendship with one another, as they face false images of one another.
Master of Two Worlds: Tsukasa recovers and exists the hospital, then encounters Subaru for the first time in real life, presumably as she was headed to the hospital to greet Tsukasa. Tsukasa can now enjoy her life outside "The World" as well as inside (this is her Freedom to Live).
DEPARTURE
The Call to Adventure: Tsukasa finds himself unable to logout.
Refusal of the Call: He rejects human contact due to his experiences outside "The World."
Supernatural Aid: He meets Mimiru, Bear, and later Subaru, as well as many others in the game.
Crossing of the First Threshold: He defeats the Silver Knight and avoids capture for a while, though he is unable to do so without the aid of the Guardian given to him by Morganna.
Belly of the Whale: He is captured and brought before Subaru, Lady of the Knights, an encounter that will shape the future of his experiences within "The World." Also, the first time we see Tsukasa, he is inside a dungeon that looks like the belly of some giant creature.
INITIATION
Road of Trials: Tsukasa's struggle is an inward one: through the help of his friends, and especially Subaru, he needs to realize his potential.
Meeting with the Goddess: At first, I thought Morganna could be the Goddess, but really, she's a malevolent figure in the story, and the Goddess is portrayed as good-natured and loving towards the hero. In my opinion, Tsukasa meets with the Goddess when he realizes that "he" is a girl IRL, and thus comes to terms with his female aspect. Subaru is also a Goddess-like figure to Tsukasa.
Woman as Temptress: Tsukasa is tormented by Macha, and persuaded by Morganna to remain in "The World," where it is safe for him. In the game series, Macha is revealed to be "the Temptress."
Atonement with the Father: He loses the fear of his father and of Morganna, and at that point, Aura awakens from her sleep.
Apotheosis: He finally becomes able to logout.
The Ultimate Boon: He can now meet his friends in the real world. Aura is free, provided she can evade constant pursuit by Skeith long enough to give the Book of Twilight to one who is worthy.
RETURN
Refusal of the Return: Tsukasa is unsure of whether he wants to return after discovering his identity in the world, and the implications regarding his involvement with Subaru. Subaru chases these fears away, saying that she was "touched by his soul."
The Magic Flight: I couldn't come up with anything for this (at least in .hack//SIGN); does anyone have any ideas?
Rescue from Without: Helba shuts down the Net Slum in order to rescue Tsukasa and his friends from Skeith.
Crossing of the Return Threshold: Tsukasa, Subaru and Mimiru must test their resolve as well as their belief in their friendship with one another, as they face false images of one another.
Master of Two Worlds: Tsukasa recovers and exists the hospital, then encounters Subaru for the first time in real life, presumably as she was headed to the hospital to greet Tsukasa. Tsukasa can now enjoy her life outside "The World" as well as inside (this is her Freedom to Live).
Wow! Very deep stuff, though I'd like to put my own voice into this,marthwmaster wrote:Is anyone familiar with Joseph Campbell's monomyth theory (also known as the Hero's Journey)? If you've not heard of it, check out Wikipedia's entry on "monomyth" at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monomyth. Despite the warnings posted at the top, as far as I can tell it seems accurate for the most part. I spent some time coming up with a monomythic analysis of .hack//SIGN and the .hack videogames. Here's what I came up with for SIGN for each phase of the journey (note that not all of these steps occur in chronological order to the story). Please refer to the Wikipedia entry as you read this unless you're intimately familiar with the monomyth theory, as it'll make the most sense that way.
DEPARTURE
The Call to Adventure: Tsukasa finds himself unable to logout.
Refusal of the Call: He rejects human contact due to his experiences outside "The World."
Supernatural Aid: He meets Mimiru, Bear, and later Subaru, as well as many others in the game.
Crossing of the First Threshold: He defeats the Silver Knight and avoids capture for a while, though he is unable to do so without the aid of the Guardian given to him by Morganna.
Belly of the Whale: He is captured and brought before Subaru, Lady of the Knights, an encounter that will shape the future of his experiences within "The World." Also, the first time we see Tsukasa, he is inside a dungeon that looks like the belly of some giant creature.
INITIATION
Road of Trials: Tsukasa's struggle is an inward one: through the help of his friends, and especially Subaru, he needs to realize his potential.
Meeting with the Goddess: At first, I thought Morganna could be the Goddess, but really, she's a malevolent figure in the story, and the Goddess is portrayed as good-natured and loving towards the hero. In my opinion, Tsukasa meets with the Goddess when he realizes that "he" is a girl IRL, and thus comes to terms with his female aspect. Subaru is also a Goddess-like figure to Tsukasa.
Woman as Temptress: Tsukasa is tormented by Macha, and persuaded by Morganna to remain in "The World," where it is safe for him. In the game series, Macha is revealed to be "the Temptress."
Atonement with the Father: He loses the fear of his father and of Morganna, and at that point, Aura awakens from her sleep.
Apotheosis: He finally becomes able to logout.
The Ultimate Boon: He can now meet his friends in the real world. Aura is free, provided she can evade constant pursuit by Skeith long enough to give the Book of Twilight to one who is worthy.
RETURN
Refusal of the Return: Tsukasa is unsure of whether he wants to return after discovering his identity in the world, and the implications regarding his involvement with Subaru. Subaru chases these fears away, saying that she was "touched by his soul."
The Magic Flight: I couldn't come up with anything for this (at least in .hack//SIGN); does anyone have any ideas?
Rescue from Without: Helba shuts down the Net Slum in order to rescue Tsukasa and his friends from Skeith.
Crossing of the Return Threshold: Tsukasa, Subaru and Mimiru must test their resolve as well as their belief in their friendship with one another, as they face false images of one another.
Master of Two Worlds: Tsukasa recovers and exists the hospital, then encounters Subaru for the first time in real life, presumably as she was headed to the hospital to greet Tsukasa. Tsukasa can now enjoy her life outside "The World" as well as inside (this is her Freedom to Live).
DEPARTURE
The Call to Adventure: As you have said, his inability to logout of of the world.
Refusal of the Call:Unsure what to do, without guidance, he wanders aimlessly. (Though if taken in concert with Morganna's plans where her focus was to get Tsukasa to befriend Mimiru and company, with him unknowingly following it, this may also be called the "Refusal of the Call".)
Supernatural Aid: Tsukasa is given the Guardian by Morganna, though does not know it at the time.
The Crossing of the First Threshold: Agreed, defeating Silver Knight with "Supernatural Aid" was his first trial.
Belly of the Whale: As you have mentioned, this may be symbolism that he never escapes his enemies presence, though for the time his enemies are the Silver Knights and as said above, his capture shapes his future.
INITIATION
Road of Trials: As you have said, his struggle is an internal one.
The Meeting with the Goddess: There are many ways to view this, Morganna herself was proclaimed a Goddess by the AI's of The World, though Subaru was able to connect with Tsukasa perfectly and Aura was in her own way, able to influence him, he wished to find the Key of the Twilight to free her, there is also your theory, though that may come later in events.
Woman as Temptress:Macha, Morganna, and Aura, these three bound him to The World in some way or another, Macha attempts to talk Tsukasa out of going to see the Broken Man, but he goes anyway.
Atonement with the Father: No less short then the father of The World, Harald Hoerwick. Tsukasa absorbed all he had said when no one else understood it. If he had not been data drained by the Guardian and lost parts of his memory he may have been able to free Aura quicker.
Apotheosis: His mind was broken by Morganna, though through this he finds new strength and the ability to have courage. Feeling the ultimate pain, he knows nothing can scare him any longer.
The Ultimate Boon: Hearing of Subaru's true condition he becomes stable once more and makes his way to Net Slum.
RETURN
Refusal of the Return: Agree with yours.
The Magic Flight:: "A mad dash is made by the Hero to return with the prize." The "prize" in this example is Subaru escaping Net Slum fleeing to "Grima Lowe".
Rescue from Without: His friend's and him put up one final stand though the true help comes from one he once considered a friend, sacrificing herself to save Tsukasa and the party.
Crossing of the Return Threshold: He stands up to Morganna and goes against her will, with his positive emotions also waking up Aura, Morganna's undoing. This last threshold Guardian was none other then Morganna herself.
Master of Two Worlds: Ditto
Well this is indeed an interesting topic!
As you know Security,
Is Mortal's greatest enemy
Is Mortal's greatest enemy
The one thing that caught my eye in the series was in the first few episodes -- Tsukasa's little beetle bug. Before he meets Mimiru, he's pushing it away with the base of his rod and playing with it a little. Later on he's sitting by the river on mac Anu and brushes it off his shoulder. Eventually, he just smashes it dead with his staff. I'm not going to get into some discussion about why a little bettle bug would represent anything, but he smashed the bug when he accepted his state in The World and his inability to return to reality. Up until then, the bug was just bothering him.
Speaking of bugs, fireflies became pretty redundant later on, too. They seem to be a Subaru thing, though I believe in one episode they were with Mimiru's appearance with Tsukasa as well. Again, no big philosophical stance here, but they seemed to be there as a kind of comforting thing. He never felt a need to rid of them, brush them off, or smash 'em dead.
Speaking of bugs, fireflies became pretty redundant later on, too. They seem to be a Subaru thing, though I believe in one episode they were with Mimiru's appearance with Tsukasa as well. Again, no big philosophical stance here, but they seemed to be there as a kind of comforting thing. He never felt a need to rid of them, brush them off, or smash 'em dead.
