more glitches?

[morino]

Well, I haven't seen anyone talk about the couple things I've ran into recently, so I figured I might as well share them!

I've recently experienced (one just happened to me, and it's what made me decide to finally post) a couple battle-related glitches that are pretty weird.

The one I just ran into is most definitely the strangest I have to experience so far. I was in one of the Lvl 150 desert areas, fighting groups of Abados for virus cores, when I saw two groups really close to each other (it was because one of the groups that moves around the field had gotten really close to one of the stationary groups that always stays around the treasure chests, like what you get symbol fragments from) and decided to see if I could ram both of them with my bike at the same time. I ended up hitting (or that's what the game decided, anyway) the moving group. I beat them, and then as soon as the battle ended I put the Demon Safe Shoes back on so I wouldn't get into a battle with the other group right away and could get back on the bike and ram them.

Here's the part where it starts to get a little odd: when I turned the camera to look at the remaining (the stationary) group, there was only one Abado left circling the treasure chest. Now, I'm almost 100% sure that there were two there before, and I don't think I've ever seen a monster group comprised of just one of anything, besides the bosses.

After I got over my initial confusion, I just got back on my bike, rammed it and finished it, and then when the battle was over I started to walk away to the next group, but as I was walking away a monster indicator arrow popped up and was pointing behind me - so I turned the camera again, only to see that there was another Abado where the one I just defeated was. Nothing else odd happened after I finished with it.

This has never happened to me before, and I thought it was strange enough that other people might want to hear about it. If you want to try to get it to happen yourself, I was at Sigma: Galloping Bull's Eye Paraphrase, but I think it could possibly work on any area that had an overabundance of monsters.


The other glitch I've been encountering is actually during battle. I can't remember which bike part it is, but whenever I ram enemies it inflicts the charm status. Now, if I hit all the enemies with my bike, so that they're all charmed once the battle starts, my party members have a habit of just... not doing anything for long stretches of time. They'll run around the battle, not attacking, and it doesn't seem to matter what strategy they're set to. I was messing around with just Silabus in my party at one point, and it took him a good minute to decide to attack the enemy, even after I switched between setting him to both Tenacity and Rage. It's a little annoying, but kind of funny too.

[TheSorrow]

Pretty interesting, but i wouldn't say they're glitches...maybe the first one could be considered one, but the 2nd is just the AI going stupid, as it always happens in EVERY videogame with the right conditions. Also, i think i can explain why both happen, and i've ran into them as well :P

In the first one, you first have to understand that when a battle starts, the game removes all objects in the map (barrels, enemies, battle areas and chests), the battle area is defined, and then battle starts like normal. Once the battle is over (because of escaping with a Smoke Grenade or winning the battle), the game will then load the still-avaliable objects in the map, but sometimes you and your characters will be in the way of an enemy's place, and because the space is occupied, the game won't load the enemy until the space is unoccupied again, and it'll also take a few seconds until it fully loads and becomes "targettable" and all. What happened with you was that your team was in the enemy's spot, causing it to not load and only show the single Abado, and after you defeated the other Abado and moved away, the spot was free and the Abado loaded; if you would have just moved away when only the single Abado loaded, you would've seen the 2nd one after a few seconds. This can also be seen better with a Battle Area...try fighting an enemy that, when the battle triggers, your battle area "overlaps" the other one (it'll be removed before any overlapping though). Once you're done with the battle, if you stay in the spot where the battle area was (which is large enough to stay there unexpectedly), you'll see that it's gone...but once you walk away, you'll see how the Battle Area loads again like normal. This can be seen even easier in some maps where the Battle Area is right in front of the starting Plataform..it won't load until you move away enough.

And for the second one...because a "Charmed" enemy is both an enemy and an ally (it can inflict damage to everyone...and could heal everyone, they never do it but it should be possible), your party members won't find any "enemy" and so they'll walk around doing nothing until they either get a bit smart for some random reason or you force them to attack to them, the best way is by ordering them to do skills to the enemies through the menu. Not a glitch, that's just how the AI is, sadly.

[morino]

I see, that all makes sense. I have noticed what you were talking about with the Battle Arenas before, too.

And haha, as far as the AI goes, I kind of thought it had to do something with charmed enemies being "allies" at the same time, but I figured I'd ask before assuming. I wonder why it is sometimes your party members get "smart" again and decide to attack? So strange.

Thanks for explaining!

[Master ZED]

The first one may be just a gameplay mechanism, not a glitch. CC2 definitely acknowledges and prevents its abuse in trap rooms in the Forest of Pain, for example. You can't fight all enemies of the same group and win entirely different battles each time to drive the dead enemy party count up for Phase Bonuses; it will only acknowledge the group's defeat when the last one is truly dead (faded away) and you get the EXP screen for that kill. This function's intent is likely to help prevent suddenly being thrust into another battle by a nearby group, but it only helps so much.

That doesn't mean it can't be abused whatsoever, though.

The second really is just the "AI" being stupid; it can happen with Confused, Paralyzed, and Sleeping enemies too. None of those are as bad as Charm though, since that status is both persistent and hard to remove. I suppose this may have been done so the status can have its intended effect of allowing your victim to fight for you, but practically, this is rarely ever beneficial if you're using Charm through a weapon (through The Lovers or Shock Tempt, maybe). Most people practice Charm affliction as a higher form of Paralysis anyway, and I stopped using it much for the very reason you described (so now I can't remember if Charmed enemies attack each other or not... I think that may have been another problem, that the Charmed and Confused consider themselves mercenaries on the side of their former enemies, and the status is only useful if at least one enemy doesn't have it).

[TheSorrow]

(so now I can't remember if Charmed enemies attack each other or not... I think that may have been another problem, that the Charmed and Confused consider themselves mercenaries on the side of their former enemies, and the status is only useful if at least one enemy doesn't have it).

Yay :3
I don't know if Doppel has any "special" rules concerning who are his enemies and allies to begin with...either way, they were sure showing their love to each other right there.

And as of why your team members can SOMETIMES attack Charmed, and Confused/Paralyzed/Sleeping enemies, and it should be for the same reason why your members set as Life can sometimes do a normal attack on enemies (i've rarely see it with my team members, but i see it alot in PK battles with the "victim" attacking...heck, i tend to force the poor victims to fight back for lulz)...it just happens at random whenever the unattacking member stands too close to the possible target, mostly when the member is walking right towards the enemy or it's stuck between them and the battle area walls, though that could simply be because it can't move and it's standing besides an enemy all the time. I'd like to think that the "instruction" that defines that could be like:
If Character_Bored=True & Close_Enemy=True Then
Target Enemy
Attack Enemy
Go back to running and hiding

[GyppyGirl2021]

Sigma: Roaring Friend's Freedom. Level 150, Fire+Earth element, Grass Field (Evening). There is a part of the area that is SEVERELY glitched... I'm gonna try the same keywords on other servers to see if the same problem is there. XD

Edit: Just checked it on Delta and Theta servers, they're different field designs. XD

[TheSorrow]

Great finding :P That's some map overlap-thing glitch, caused by indeed an overlap in the map and it leaves a little gap in the middle...a gap you can go through and be able to walk through water, get underground (by walking too far until the water ends, then using the bike to go down), and make Doppel chase you to have epic sea battles with him.
And map designs are arranged differently on each server, so an area with some name will be completely different to an area with the same name but different server. However, map designs aren't unique, and they usually have "mirror" areas; areas that are completely the same in design, and only sometimes different in the area conditions (like morning, night, raining, symbol fragment, boss, etc), and to find those mirror areas, all you have to do is go up and down on the list for the first and second keyword (though sometimes it only applies to the second keyword). This one glitchy area has it's mirrors too, where the very same glitch appears, and here they are :D

Sigma: Roaring Friend's Freedom (well, it's the one you found)
Sigma: Roaring Forbidden Freedom
Sigma: Roaring Idling Freedom
Sigma: Roaring Returning Freedom
Sigma: Spring's Friend's Freedom
Sigma: Spring's Forbidden Freedom
Sigma: Spring's Idling Freedom
Sigma: Spring's Returning Freedom
Sigma: Concealed Friend's Freedom
Sigma: Concealed Forbidden Freedom
Sigma: Concealed Idling Freedom
Sigma: Concealed Returning Freedom
Sigma: Protected Friend's Freedom
Sigma: Protected Forbidden Freedom
Sigma: Protected Idling Freedom
Sigma: Protected Returning Freedom

Lots of mirrors o-o And they're all evening-ish areas, only different in being symbol fragment or boss fragment area. Oh well, now we have 16 more areas where this glitch works XD And i'm sure there are more mirror areas...at least in the Sigma server, there should be another 16 areas of the very same kind, but in a Wilderness-type of field (in the case of that, you walk through air instead in the gap), but they're going to be harder to find...at least using the "method" i use :P lol

[GyppyGirl2021]

XD That's awesome. And I didn't know that - the last time I tried the same keyword on different servers, it was like exactly the same area. XP (I fail. XD)

[TheSorrow]

Tell me which area it was, and i'd be surprised yet glad to be proven wrong with it. Because seriously, even though it would be great if areas with the same name in different servers had the same design (though boring, but at least it would be easier to locate "glitchy areas), i've never found a single keyword combination that has the same map design in different servers, and i've tried ALOT of them XD The only thing equal between them is the type of area (field, dungeon, cloister, etc, as well as the conditions), because that's derivated from the keywords themselves, not the server..and the map design is. Perhaps not at coding-level, but yes when all you have is a PS2, a game, and a full list of keywords.

[GyppyGirl2021]

Unfortunately, it was a LONG time ago, and I don't remember the keywords... not to mention I don't even remember if it was in G.U. or IMOQ xD

('cuz I do remember visiting a few similar areas in IMOQ...)

[TheSorrow]

That's...great. Considering too how in IMOQ areas were EXACTLY the same as long as their type matched, and i never really paid attention to the dungeon layouts, but they all were similar to each other in many details too; same kind of rooms and paths and all XD

[Master ZED]

i've never found a single keyword combination that has the same map design in different servers, and i've tried ALOT of them XD

My Moon Rabbit fields have the same design in Delta and Theta servers (or at least the first one does):

Great Cursed Empire
Submissive Leading Empire
Great Failing Empire
Submissive Forbidden Freedom

[CountDOOMDestroyer]

the second one...because a "Charmed" enemy is both an enemy and an ally (it can inflict damage to everyone...and could heal everyone, they never do it but it should be possible), your party members won't find any "enemy" and so they'll walk around doing nothing until they either get a bit smart for some random reason or you force them to attack to them, the best way is by ordering them to do skills to the enemies through the menu. Not a glitch, that's just how the AI is, sadly.

this is weird tho... see with me, as i have charmed many an enemy and also had endrance in my party with his avatar weapon, my party members always attack the charmed enemy. they dont just run around. on my bike, which has the charm effect, after ramming into an enemy my party members start attacking immediately as well. how can that b the AI just going stupid as u so quaintly put it? however i think the reason y is cuz i always have my characters on free will... idk

[GyppyGirl2021]

I've never had any problem with my party attacking charmed enemies.

btw, I know Endrance's stats are broken but I don't use him. I hate him. >.>

[TheSorrow]

this is weird tho... see with me, as i have charmed many an enemy and also had endrance in my party with his avatar weapon, my party members always attack the charmed enemy. they dont just run around. on my bike, which has the charm effect, after ramming into an enemy my party members start attacking immediately as well. how can that b the AI just going stupid as u so quaintly put it? however i think the reason y is cuz i always have my characters on free will... idk

Well, the "AI going stupid" is a very possible and logical thing to happen. AI's are nothing more but instructions made in regards of many different events that can happen (the actions a "brain" will do in response to some thing), and there are many ways for the AI to be put against a situation it has no response to, or more than one that contradicts each other, or trick it into repeating something...in this case, it's a situation it wasn't supposed to face like that; fight enemies that are flagged as both "enemy/ally".
And sure, sometimes they will attack the charmed enemies...especially when on Rage, they can go and instantly lock onto an enemy and use a skil as soon as the battle starts, whether the enemy is charmed or not....but most of the time, they'll take their lock off the enemy, and as long as they're charmed, they won't target the enemies again...and just keep moving around trying to find a non-ally target. You can check it yourself right now, by charming an enemy, and simply wait for your team members to attack it...it might happen a few times, but most of the time, they won't, and if they attacked then they'll stop attacking soon.

btw, I know Endrance's stats are broken but I don't use him. I hate him. >.>

Well, it's the first time i've heard of Endrance having "broken stats" o-O I like using him, but he doesn't have truly high stats, somewhat higher than other Blade Brandiers but nothing too big and nothing that will make a worthy difference. You might inflict more damage with Endrance than with Silabus or Kaede, but it's nothing deadly either, and with the same equipment, the damage will only be like...6 points higher.

[GyppyGirl2021]

It was more in reference to his insane HP and SP, which also appears to be present in Shino. (Although, in my current Redemption experimentation clear data, Atoli's stats, aside from HP, SP and M-DEF, are considerably higher than Shino's, especially her elemental stats. I'm not sure if that's natural, from Flame Dancer or Virus Core boosts...)

Silabus and the other Blades tend to have lower HP than Haseo at the same level, but even without a +HP attachment, Endrance beats him by at least 200, or so it seems. >.>

[EtherealDeath]

-

[GyppyGirl2021]

I was talking about Endrance beating Haseo, not Silabus. XP

[EtherealDeath]

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[CountDOOMDestroyer]

[quote="TheSorrow"]
Well, the "AI going stupid" is a very possible and logical thing to happen. AI's are nothing more but instructions made in regards of many different events that can happen (the actions a "brain" will do in response to some thing), and there are many ways for the AI to be put against a situation it has no response to, or more than one that contradicts each other, or trick it into repeating something...in this case, it's a situation it wasn't supposed to face like that; fight enemies that are flagged as both "enemy/ally".
And sure, sometimes they will attack the charmed enemies...especially when on Rage, they can go and instantly lock onto an enemy and use a skil as soon as the battle starts, whether the enemy is charmed or not....but most of the time, they'll take their lock off the enemy, and as long as they're charmed, they won't target the enemies again...and just keep moving around trying to find a non-ally target. You can check it yourself right now, by charming an enemy, and simply wait for your team members to attack it...it might happen a few times, but most of the time, they won't, and if they attacked then they'll stop attacking soon.[quote/]
i did this a couple of times and only once did they not attack. all other times they did. i believe that was the first time it happened